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Post by Kyle Mitchell on Sept 25, 2013 13:32:57 GMT -6
4G internet for smartphones is separate from high speed internet in your home. The only way they are connected is if your smartphone is your only connection to the Internet and you have no other service. Streator has had high speed fiber-optic for years. That's how Mediacom connects Streator to the Internet. Verizon FINALLY updated Streator's cell service to 4G-LTE last week. It works. I speed-tested it and averaged 10mb/s to as high as 20mb/s, depending on the time of day and bandwidth usage. Considering DSL is around 1.5mb/s, that's very good speed. Mediacom offers high speed broadband Internet service as fast as 50mb/s for residiential, and up to 100mb/s for commercial. It's expensive but it's there if you really need it. Any speed around 20mb/s for residential use will handle any full high-def content one could download from netflix, AppleTV, etc. There IS a separate Internet sevice going up in IL called iFiber. www.ifiber.org/ifiber/For the last 18 months there has been utilty work all over Northern IL. Ever noticed utilty crews burying bright orange plastic conduit? That's the ifiber network going in. It covers the Northern 3rd of IL and there was new fiberoptic cable installed all over Streator last year. iFiber's hub in this area will NIU. Several Streator institutions have signed up for it. iFiber will not be cheap either. Early adapters will pay a high price. As more people join the price will drop, but that could take years. Traditional sevice providers like Mediacom, Frontier, and Verizon will easily update their Internet service to compete. ifiber's initial target is large businesses, schools, hospitals, etc. iFiber's initial cost is being covered by goverment grants, our tax dollars. Streator is NOT isolated or behind as far as Interent service is concerned. It's just not cheap. Hopefully competition will bring down prices, faster speeds, and higher data limits. I brought up 4G as an example of how we had to wait for years after other communities had it for private companies to put it in here. It is great that it is finally here, two years after Ottawa. I think it could very well be the same for a fiber optic network. One of the advantages to a municipal network in my opinion is that we would possibly be able to get it much sooner. Mediacom's high speeds don't even compare to the fiber optic capabilities. iFiber is going to institutions as you said but not to businesses. The network to reach commercial locations to encourage employers to locate here is what I think our City should have already been considering. I think that because of the economics of Streator, the private companies will expand other communities first and like 4G we will be years behind. |
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Post by Kyle Mitchell on Sept 25, 2013 13:58:40 GMT -6
You gave an incomplete example about Chanute Kansas and their broadband situation as a comparison to Streator. You conveniently left out how long it took them to make $600,000 until I questioned your example. Then you had to add how long it took and chime in with "the sooner started, the sooner that [revenue] could happen." How far do you think that $138,000 will go by doing that? I didn't conveniently leave that out. Their initial investment in 1984 wasn't to create revenue, it was to control their power grid, which probably did start creating benefits for residents right away. When they did decide to start expanding it to be available to businesses in 2006, I'm sure it did start producing more revenue, but we don't have those numbers. They finally just started expanding to residential customers in 2011. Now just two two years later it takes them just one year to make $600,000.00. I think that is impressive. I think $138,000.00 would go a lot farther to producing income as part of a fiber optic network than a fountain in City Park. Nothing makes me an expert and I never said I was, or that they had to jump at all. Obviously they don't have to follow the suggestions that I give them, I don't think they have yet. Is that because I've been too tautologous? Thats what I said, so yes. When someone exposes himself in the middle of the street and I tell them, how many more do I have to watch do it without saying anything for it to ever end? BS is what that is. If they did something about the problems once in a while, I wouldn't have to keep going back to talk about the same things over and over again. Obviously they don't have to jump to my suggestions, so I get to the point of posting videos on line. And that helps how? The bar problems is the issue that I have been most tautologous on. When I complained about it the first time, I was not tautologous, but they didn't do anything about the problem then. Problems don't just go away by themselves. After six years of trying to get something done, I imagine the complaints would start to seem tautologous. Posting the videos got a lot more people to realize how bad the problem is, and created more conversation about it. Time will tell, but it has already seemed to have done more than any conversation I have had with any City leader. |
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Post by Kyle Mitchell on Sept 25, 2013 14:18:38 GMT -6
I am not saying that they do not want jobs here, only that it is not a high priority to them. That is my opinion from the comments I've heard at meetings over the years. A club house, a band shell, a fountain and other amenities are all more of priorities to them. Have you ever thought that maybe these are all easily attainable items that improve the towns appearance? For too long the appearance of the town and the condition of the buildings have been over-looked, and now the town looks sad, dilapidated, and a shell of its own-self. The Council has started to make the right steps to improving those aspects. The giant leaps you want the council to take don't happen over night let alone a couple of months. What is the high priority items. Just because things are not discussed publicly doesn't mean its not high priority or not being discussed. Where are all these jobs that are coming into Illinois that we are missing out on? I don't think they are the right steps though. I think that investing into bringing jobs here will correct the real problems and then the rest will follow. Who said anything about a couple months, the City has been going in the same direction they have been for years and years. I could care less about what priorities they talk about privately, the lack of sufficient results is what I end up seeing. I don't see a band shell or fountain creating much revenue at all. In my opinion, jobs are what will create revenue for residents, building owners and the City. After they get done with the park will they start fixing up buildings next? Just City buildings or private buildings too? Won't that demolition fund need to be multiplied each year to keep up? |
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Post by dog on Sept 25, 2013 15:32:07 GMT -6
Mediacom's high speeds don't even compare to the fiber optic capabilities. Are there currently any businesses in town that have complained that they need the high speeds of fiber optics to stay in business and be competitive? |
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Post by Kyle Mitchell on Sept 25, 2013 15:32:49 GMT -6
The are many ways to look at and improve economic development. In my opinion, attempts should be multi-faceted (don't put all of your eggs in one basket). For example, research has also shown that parks can improve economic development - atfiles.org/files/pdf/citiesparksecon.pdf Fiber optics could be a possibility; however, it will take much more time and effort and money. Urbana-Champaign recently spent 29.4 million on its fiber optic system and still has not covered the entire city area. "UC2B Governance and Management UC2B is an intergovernmental consortium of the University of Illinois and the cities of Urbana and Champaign dedicated to building and operating an open-access fiber-optic broadband network throughout the Champaign-Urbana area. The project is made possible by a $22.5 million grant from the U.S. Department of Commerce’s National Telecommunications and Information Administration (NTIA). The State of Illinois provided a $3.5 million grant and local matching funds added an additional $3.4 million to fund the project. The foundation of the UC2B network will be the fiber-optic “backbone” infrastructure that will be constructed with the grant money. The grant will also provide “fiber-to-the-premises” (FTTP) connectivity directly to well over 150 Community Anchor Institutions throughout Champaign, Urbana, and Savoy and to households in several underserved neighborhoods in Champaign and Urbana. This direct connectivity will enable improved access/support to health care, educational and recreational institutions, public safety and government agencies, and social service and religious organizations, as well as increased access to public computing centers. and a sustainable adoption and educational outreach program for vulnerable populations. Training, entertainment, and social networking opportunities will also be enhanced." The project also started back in 1994 according to their timeline (nearly 20 years to complete). $138,000 vs. $29,400,000. That would be 213 fountains. NTIA listed in the Urbana-Champaign project is also the funding provided to ifiber (68.1million for the i-fiber network). The current I-fiber project will connect 533 selected Community Anchor Institutions ((CAIs)as defined by the Federal Government, include schools, libraries, non-profit medical and healthcare providers, public safety entities, community colleges and other institutions of higher education)to the fiber network. However, after the project’s completion, connection will be open and available for other business partners and third party providers.
This last sentence is where my questions come up. If this is soon to be readily available for businesses, then how much investment should be done by the city? Champaign Urbana is a lot bigger - 232,000. Adjusting for size by population would provide a more comparative cost of about $5 million. About 88% of the Champaign Urbana project was covered with grant money. If that could happen here, it would only be $600,000 out of City funds. Heck, that is only a little more than a band shell, and a fountain. Chanute, with 50% less people than us is able to make $600,000 just a couple of years after finishing their expansion. Using that number, adjusted for population, we could make $900,00/year in a couple of years. How much do you expect the fountain will generate? Sorry, I just do not see it as economic development. I am sure it could be available to businesses as soon as it is available to the City, if the business wants to pay to run it on their own, but that would be very, very costly. I may be wrong, but I think we will wait for years, just like 4G, if we wait for a private company to expand the network to make it available to businesses. Have those companies been knocking on the City's door to find out about permits for that expansion? |
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Post by greekgod on Sept 25, 2013 15:59:44 GMT -6
4G internet for smartphones is separate from high speed internet in your home. The only way they are connected is if your smartphone is your only connection to the Internet and you have no other service. Streator has had high speed fiber-optic for years. That's how Mediacom connects Streator to the Internet. Verizon FINALLY updated Streator's cell service to 4G-LTE last week. It works. I speed-tested it and averaged 10mb/s to as high as 20mb/s, depending on the time of day and bandwidth usage. Considering DSL is around 1.5mb/s, that's very good speed. Mediacom offers high speed broadband Internet service as fast as 50mb/s for residiential, and up to 100mb/s for commercial. It's expensive but it's there if you really need it. Any speed around 20mb/s for residential use will handle any full high-def content one could download from netflix, AppleTV, etc. There IS a separate Internet sevice going up in IL called iFiber. www.ifiber.org/ifiber/For the last 18 months there has been utilty work all over Northern IL. Ever noticed utilty crews burying bright orange plastic conduit? That's the ifiber network going in. It covers the Northern 3rd of IL and there was new fiberoptic cable installed all over Streator last year. iFiber's hub in this area will NIU. Several Streator institutions have signed up for it. iFiber will not be cheap either. Early adapters will pay a high price. As more people join the price will drop, but that could take years. Traditional sevice providers like Mediacom, Frontier, and Verizon will easily update their Internet service to compete. ifiber's initial target is large businesses, schools, hospitals, etc. iFiber's initial cost is being covered by goverment grants, our tax dollars. Streator is NOT isolated or behind as far as Interent service is concerned. It's just not cheap. Hopefully competition will bring down prices, faster speeds, and higher data limits. I brought up 4G as an example of how we had to wait for years after other communities had it for private companies to put it in here. It is great that it is finally here, two years after Ottawa. I think it could very well be the same for a fiber optic network. One of the advantages to a municipal network in my opinion is that we would possibly be able to get it much sooner. Mediacom's high speeds don't even compare to the fiber optic capabilities. iFiber is going to institutions as you said but not to businesses. The network to reach commercial locations to encourage employers to locate here is what I think our City should have already been considering. I think that because of the economics of Streator, the private companies will expand other communities first and like 4G we will be years behind. myself As I read this post makes me appreciate the prudence of the Streator City Council by not giving you a check to invest our tax dollars for what as you say is "in my opinon", "is what I think" and end with your last sentence stating "I think", in the constuction of the fiber optics project you suggested. You call the City Council as not being "Progessive". Sorry, I disagree. I believe they have been "Progressive and Prudent" in getting the biggest "bang for our taxpayer bucks", by INVESTING in improving our community. How much would the improvements to our City Park cost had the Streator Council not taken advantage of the Soderstrom Famly and the Contibutions of the Families in Streator to build the band shell. Perhaps it would never have been built. You know what Kyle, if it makes our City look better and that help all of us. Perhaps you should have a Fiber Optics company you have invested in bring their offer to the City Council. The term Progressive is not synomous with Irresponsible. g |
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Post by greekgod on Sept 25, 2013 15:59:54 GMT -6
4G internet for smartphones is separate from high speed internet in your home. The only way they are connected is if your smartphone is your only connection to the Internet and you have no other service. Streator has had high speed fiber-optic for years. That's how Mediacom connects Streator to the Internet. Verizon FINALLY updated Streator's cell service to 4G-LTE last week. It works. I speed-tested it and averaged 10mb/s to as high as 20mb/s, depending on the time of day and bandwidth usage. Considering DSL is around 1.5mb/s, that's very good speed. Mediacom offers high speed broadband Internet service as fast as 50mb/s for residiential, and up to 100mb/s for commercial. It's expensive but it's there if you really need it. Any speed around 20mb/s for residential use will handle any full high-def content one could download from netflix, AppleTV, etc. There IS a separate Internet sevice going up in IL called iFiber. www.ifiber.org/ifiber/For the last 18 months there has been utilty work all over Northern IL. Ever noticed utilty crews burying bright orange plastic conduit? That's the ifiber network going in. It covers the Northern 3rd of IL and there was new fiberoptic cable installed all over Streator last year. iFiber's hub in this area will NIU. Several Streator institutions have signed up for it. iFiber will not be cheap either. Early adapters will pay a high price. As more people join the price will drop, but that could take years. Traditional sevice providers like Mediacom, Frontier, and Verizon will easily update their Internet service to compete. ifiber's initial target is large businesses, schools, hospitals, etc. iFiber's initial cost is being covered by goverment grants, our tax dollars. Streator is NOT isolated or behind as far as Interent service is concerned. It's just not cheap. Hopefully competition will bring down prices, faster speeds, and higher data limits. I brought up 4G as an example of how we had to wait for years after other communities had it for private companies to put it in here. It is great that it is finally here, two years after Ottawa. I think it could very well be the same for a fiber optic network. One of the advantages to a municipal network in my opinion is that we would possibly be able to get it much sooner. Mediacom's high speeds don't even compare to the fiber optic capabilities. iFiber is going to institutions as you said but not to businesses. The network to reach commercial locations to encourage employers to locate here is what I think our City should have already been considering. I think that because of the economics of Streator, the private companies will expand other communities first and like 4G we will be years behind. myself As I read this post makes me appreciate the prudence of the Streator City Council by not giving you a check to invest our tax dollars for what as you say is "in my opinon", "is what I think" and end with your last sentence stating "I think", in the constuction of the fiber optics project you suggested. You call the City Council as not being "Progessive". Sorry, I disagree. I believe they have been "Progressive and Prudent" in getting the biggest "bang for our taxpayer bucks", by INVESTING in improving our community. How much would the improvements to our City Park cost had the Streator Council not taken advantage of the Soderstrom Famly and the Contibutions of the Families in Streator to build the band shell. Perhaps it would never have been built. You know what Kyle, if it makes our City look better and that help all of us. Perhaps you should have a Fiber Optics company you have invested in bring their offer to the City Council. The term Progressive is not synomous with Irresponsible. g |
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Post by dog on Sept 25, 2013 16:56:53 GMT -6
Fiber optics could be a possibility; however, it will take much more time and effort and money. Urbana-Champaign recently spent 29.4 million on its fiber optic system and still has not covered the entire city area. Champaign Urbana is a lot bigger - 232,000. Adjusting for size by population would provide a more comparative cost of about $5 million. Chanute, with 50% less people than us is able to make $600,000 just a couple of years after finishing their expansion. Using that number, adjusted for population, we could make $900,00/year in a couple of years. ? You cant accurately predict the construction and corresponding price of the network based on population. For instance, Streator has a population density of about 2400 per square mile. Urbana is about 1 1/2 times that and Champaign is 2 times higher. When running the cable, it costs the same to have it available for 10 customers, or 1000 customers in that same service area. By using your formula based on population, you are figuring about 1/6 of the cost, when in actuality it might be 1/3 of the cost, or 10 million. |
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Post by dog on Sept 25, 2013 17:22:52 GMT -6
myself As I read this post makes me appreciate the prudence of the Streator City Council by not giving you a check to invest our tax dollars for what as you say is "in my opinon", "is what I think" and end with your last sentence stating "I think", in the constuction of the fiber optics project you suggested. You call the City Council as not being "Progessive". Sorry, I disagree. I believe they have been "Progressive and Prudent" in getting the biggest "bang for our taxpayer bucks", by INVESTING in improving our community. How much would the improvements to our City Park cost had the Streator Council not taken advantage of the Soderstrom Famly and the Contibutions of the Families in Streator to build the band shell. Perhaps it would never have been built. You know what Kyle, if it makes our City look better and that help all of us. Perhaps you should have a Fiber Optics company you have invested in bring their offer to the City Council. The term Progressive is not synomous with Irresponsible. g I would have to agree with you there, Greek. |
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Post by father of two on Sept 25, 2013 18:14:53 GMT -6
If Chanute started in 1984 and in 2012 turned a $600,000 profit, how long should we wait for a profit? 29 years is a long time. Does Chanute own their own electric company? What utilities do they own?
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Post by Kyle Mitchell on Sept 25, 2013 18:36:15 GMT -6
myself As I read this post makes me appreciate the prudence of the Streator City Council by not giving you a check to invest our tax dollars for what as you say is "in my opinon", "is what I think" and end with your last sentence stating "I think", in the constuction of the fiber optics project you suggested. You call the City Council as not being "Progessive". Sorry, I disagree. I believe they have been "Progressive and Prudent" in getting the biggest "bang for our taxpayer bucks", by INVESTING in improving our community. How much would the improvements to our City Park cost had the Streator Council not taken advantage of the Soderstrom Famly and the Contibutions of the Families in Streator to build the band shell. Perhaps it would never have been built. You know what Kyle, if it makes our City look better and that help all of us. Perhaps you should have a Fiber Optics company you have invested in bring their offer to the City Council. The term Progressive is not synomous with Irresponsible. g I was not asking the city for a check to invest tax payer money. I was asking them to put more into trying to bring livable wage jobs and to look into a municipally owned fiber optic network to help do that. Don't worry though, I am sure that it won't happen. Prudence will continue us on our current course. Declining population and property values. I have every confidence that the band shell would have been built either way; they wanted it and committed taxpayers to paying for it. It is nice that they did get some donations. |
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Post by Kyle Mitchell on Sept 25, 2013 18:44:00 GMT -6
If Chanute started in 1984 and in 2012 turned a $600,000 profit, how long should we wait for a profit? 29 years is a long time. Does Chanute own their own electric company? What utilities do they own? Yes they own the power company. The 1984 start was only to control their grid; it wasn't started to create revenue at all. Then they did nothing for over 20 years. Is it really fair to say it would take every community 29 years to start making profit? Every community is different. |
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Post by Kyle Mitchell on Sept 25, 2013 18:52:30 GMT -6
Champaign Urbana is a lot bigger - 232,000. Adjusting for size by population would provide a more comparative cost of about $5 million. Chanute, with 50% less people than us is able to make $600,000 just a couple of years after finishing their expansion. Using that number, adjusted for population, we could make $900,00/year in a couple of years. ? You cant accurately predict the construction and corresponding price of the network based on population. For instance, Streator has a population density of about 2400 per square mile. Urbana is about 1 1/2 times that and Champaign is 2 times higher. When running the cable, it costs the same to have it available for 10 customers, or 1000 customers in that same service area. By using your formula based on population, you are figuring about 1/6 of the cost, when in actuality it might be 1/3 of the cost, or 10 million a year. My point was that it could be spun different ways. Comparing the cost of a fiber optic network for a community of 232,000 to the $138,000 spent on the fountain isn't really fair either is it? I doubt that it would cost 10 million a year though. Every community is different. |
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Post by greekgod on Sept 25, 2013 19:15:08 GMT -6
If Chanute started in 1984 and in 2012 turned a $600,000 profit, how long should we wait for a profit? 29 years is a long time. Does Chanute own their own electric company? What utilities do they own? Yes they own the power company. The 1984 start was only to control their grid; it wasn't started to create revenue at all. Then they did nothing for over 20 years. Is it really fair to say it would take every community 29 years to start making profit? Every community is different. Kyle, I agree, it is not "fair to say it would take every community 29 years to start making (a) profit". Nor is is it fair to say that a community WILL EVER MAKE A PROFIT is it? Again, urge you to bring in a Private Company to build your dream, once you have a viable plan, other than spending taxpayer dollars, I do not think you should contiue your rant against the Streator City Council. The City Council gave you the floor. I hope they don't invest my tax dollars in what your plan. g |
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Post by Kyle Mitchell on Sept 25, 2013 19:23:48 GMT -6
It has a lot better chance of making a profit than a $138,000 fountain.
A private company would not have the benefits that a municipally owned one would.
Don't worry though, I'm sure we'll just keep heading in the same direction.
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