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Post by father of two on Dec 20, 2014 23:13:24 GMT -6
The school district has never asked for a tax referendum solely for our district. They did agree to ask for the sales tax with all the other school districts of the county.
The community passed one for the high school in the early 90's.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2014 6:32:17 GMT -6
Well prospective teachers can always go into the real world where they would: 1. Work 250 days a year; 2. Have no paid sick leave days; 3. Have no guaranteed annual raises; 4. Pay for their pensions; 5. Pay more than $2,000 a year for insurance; and 6. Get fired if they are not productive. There is a reason why Federal Mediators call teachers whiners. They DO live in the "real" world...a world set up totally by politicians and teacher unions.
Your evaluation of their worth comes from a career where you worked for the "other side," so your views...while invaluable in these discussions...are obviously slanted.
Break down many fields where a college degree is a requirement and we would be able to tear them up as well.
Teachers are society's scapegoat and the way they are funded make them an instant and easy target...you know it as well as the rest of us do.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2014 6:49:24 GMT -6
For a friggin college graduate in the year 2014!!!??
It's a GD slap in the face!!!!!!!!!!!!! Hey BUTTERS, tell that to the countless thousands of other College graduates of the class of 2014 who DIDN'T get 32 K to start, much less the plum Insurance and Retirement bennies. I think we can see who is out of touch here............. If you want those wages, go to Chicago. The ISSUE of colleges and their spewing of untold numbers of graduates into an almost non-existent employment market is being used by you and others on this board, in conjunction with our state and local school funding issues, to argue for cuts in educator's wages and benefits...correct?
What I'm reading from many on this forum is that you people simply don't believe that educators are WORTH the money and bennies they receive...base on your views of how the world should operate.
Your views about the worth of teachers are appalling, but I believe that the economics of the current state of school funding will dictate future events, not your disdain for educators.
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Post by roman on Dec 21, 2014 7:48:51 GMT -6
Well prospective teachers can always go into the real world where they would: 1. Work 250 days a year; 2. Have no paid sick leave days; 3. Have no guaranteed annual raises; 4. Pay for their pensions; 5. Pay more than $2,000 a year for insurance; and 6. Get fired if they are not productive. There is a reason why Federal Mediators call teachers whiners. They DO live in the "real" world...a world set up totally by politicians and teacher unions.
Your evaluation of their worth comes from a career where you worked for the "other side," so your views...while invaluable in these discussions...are obviously slanted.
Break down many fields where a college degree is a requirement and we would be able to tear them up as well.
Teachers are society's scapegoat and the way they are funded make them an instant and easy target...you know it as well as the rest of us do.
You missed my point. I was simply suggesting that prospective teachers may wish to venture out into the world outside of teaching and live with the realities of jobs in the private sector.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2014 8:08:47 GMT -6
They DO live in the "real" world...a world set up totally by politicians and teacher unions.
Your evaluation of their worth comes from a career where you worked for the "other side," so your views...while invaluable in these discussions...are obviously slanted.
Break down many fields where a college degree is a requirement and we would be able to tear them up as well.
Teachers are society's scapegoat and the way they are funded make them an instant and easy target...you know it as well as the rest of us do.
You missed my point. I was simply suggesting that prospective teachers may wish to venture out into the world outside of teaching and live with the realities of jobs in the private sector. You're being a bit disingenuous here concerning the "real world" dig...I didn't miss your point at all.
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Post by homer34 on Dec 21, 2014 9:19:21 GMT -6
There's cuts in the private sector also because of high unemployment rates also. I'm being asked to pay for more of my benefits and may not recieve a decent raise every year to cover cost of living all because as my employer says "you should be lucky to have a job, there's always somebody in the unemployment line ready to do yours for less" crap. So it's the same only taxpayers don't pay my wages.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2014 9:42:07 GMT -6
What amazes me is all the "armchair quarterbacks" and web surfing commandos that know exactly what a teacher should be paid. They know exactly what is "too much" compensation in regards to health insurance and pension also. And they also all know someone or have a relative in the teaching profession that is paid less than ours.
It is a result of the "poor me syndrome" ..... I don't have it so they shouldn't either.
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Post by homer34 on Dec 21, 2014 9:50:33 GMT -6
I don't have a relative who is a teacher. My attitude isn't I don't have so they shouldn't either, my attitude is I don't have it so I can't give it. My job wanted to cut my wages just because I live in streator. So somebody please tell me how I should balance all of this "raise taxes for teachers while you never know whn you may have to take a pay cut for ant reason under the sun?" Any armchair quarterbacks or web surfing commandos answer that for me?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 21, 2014 10:10:12 GMT -6
My point is are any of us qualified to determine teachers compensation?
Everybody has forgotten what the root of the problem is, the state not holding their end up in regards to promised funding, and unfunded mandates by the government.
Quinn can find money to expand healthcare to illegals and every other bleeding heart cause he believes in but can't pay bills he is supposed to ?
Hold the politicians accountable
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Post by dog on Dec 21, 2014 10:11:22 GMT -6
I have friends and relatives that are teachers, or employed by the state as police, prison guards, etc. and try to see both sides of the situation. I think some of them at the high side of the scale are overpaid. I hear people who say," let teachers see how it feels to work in the real world" and I say maybe some of these people should try working as a teacher and see if it is as "easy" as they think it is. I do think the pension system is really too generous, but then again, I don't think I would do those jobs based on the annual salary they receive. I think it is to the point now that all of us are screwed anyway. I'd say, get what you can now and get out.
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Post by homer34 on Dec 21, 2014 10:17:25 GMT -6
Also as I see, maybe Im wrong, we as taxpayers are a corporation. We pay into the system. Any other corporation that was running in the red would not throw more money into it. I'm not saying we're out to make a profit but we can't go under either. Just run the system frickin responsibly. Maybe instead of calling it a cost of living raise every year we should call it a cost of a teachers raise every year.
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Post by homer34 on Dec 21, 2014 10:20:42 GMT -6
And yes the politicians play a BIG part in it. That's why I voted the way I voted.
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Post by dog on Dec 21, 2014 10:37:36 GMT -6
My point is are any of us qualified to determine teachers compensation? Everybody has forgotten what the root of the problem is, the state not holding their end up in regards to promised funding, and unfunded mandates by the government. Quinn can find money to expand healthcare to illegals and every other bleeding heart cause he believes in but can't pay bills he is supposed to ? Hold the politicians accountable If we want a free market, teachers compensation, or for that matter ANY profession, whether it be an engineer, truck driver, or a fast food worker, should be as much as the market can bear to pay. The State of Illinois has not held up its end, but who do you really expect politicians to be held accountable. The best we can do it vote them out of office, but by then, the damage is already done. I can see sending a message by voting "no" but do any of us really think that it will change the minds of how politicians solve the problem. They really wont reduce the percentage of waste in the system , they will just cut the whole budget along with good parts of it. We will cut funding for roads, but not really waste is the road budget. So we will just end up with less services, rather than more efficient services. Illinois is a State of taxing, so one way or the other, taxes will be raised to try to fix this problem. From a pragmatic point of view, if I had to choose from two evils, I would have supported the sales tax referendum and drawn some income off of places like Peru and Ottawa, rather than having a property tax increase.
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Post by cityslicker on Dec 21, 2014 11:16:30 GMT -6
"Do it for the kids", that is the reasoning expressed by the teachers, spineless, board members, and overpaid administrators. Stand up to the teacher unions and quit being intimidated by the unproductive administrators. The student's tests show they cannot meet 50% of the standards. Does the high school still have the endowment coordinator position? Maybe a good old strike will reveal what personnel would become "SCABS"and betray their teacher's union.
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Post by OutlawwithaSnipeSniper on Dec 21, 2014 13:17:48 GMT -6
If we want a free market, teachers compensation, or for that matter ANY profession, whether it be an engineer, truck driver, or a fast food worker, should be as much as the market can bear to pay. Therein lies the crux of the issue. Given your examples, only one has virtually zero relationship to a free market system. I think you can guess which one. Place them in a relatively free market equation, and then lets see where they shake out. We don't "hate" them, we are just tired of being screwed by them.
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